Did you read the business section in todays Sunday paper?

[John_Pytlak]

Kissimmee, near Orlando.

[Cranium]

Ahhhh drive-ins. Excellent. I'm amazed there's still enough around to have an association!

I LOOVE drive-ins. Nothing like a couple of large pizzas, a six pack of beer and the hood of my Dart to round out the movie-going experience.

[marc]

Kissimmee, near Orlando.

I'll probably be at work then. Darn it!

I LOOVE drive-ins. Nothing like a couple of large pizzas, a six pack of beer and the hood of my Dart to round out the movie-going experience.

Do you mean Dodge Dart, that trusty old automobile that my father bought in 1969?

[John_Pytlak]

I'm back from the UDITOA Convention in Florida, where I spoke to 128 drive-in theatre owners about how to maintain proper screen luminance on those huge screens. There are over 400 drive-ins still in operation. Fun group of people, mostly "mom and pop" theatre owners, rather than large corporations.

[FilmIs4Ever]

Hey John!
I'm glad to see you're back. On the subject of film and theatres, is it true that Kodak is trying to completely phase out film prints in theatres??? I think it would be a real shame if this were to come to pass. I have seen the proposed "new scheme" for film production at the Kodak website, which would digitize all of the camera negatives instead of using the highest quality optical contact process. I think that this is an unacceptable image loss, as do many others. I think that this would kill theatres instead of helping them. (I confess I am currently seeking a job as a film splicer/projectionist :oops:) Do you know if Kodak still plans to support film projection in the future, or is it going to do with prints what its trying to do with x-rays?

[John_Pytlak]

Last year was the BEST EVER for Kodak Entertainment Imaging, with record amounts of FILM being used in theatres around the world. Kodak continues to invest about 70% of motion picture R&D in FILM related programs, with four NEW camera films introduced last year, and more to come this year (VISION2 films). Kodak is ALSO a leader in digital imaging and Digital Cinema, but sees a long life for 35mm film too:

Here is what Richard Sehlin, Kodak EI Chief Technology Officer has to say about the future of film:

http://www.kodak.com/country/US/en/moti ... hlin.shtml

For the much hyped "Star Wars Episode 2: Attack of the Clones", there were less than 100 digital theatres, and over 10,000 that showed FILM prints. There are over 100,000 35mm FILM theatres in operation worldwide.

Remember, Variety Magazine wrote "Film is Dead" almost 50 years ago, when Ampex introduced 2-inch videotape. Who "died" first? :roll:

[Maurizio Di Cintio]

Well, John, personally I don't.
I do not agree with you on the discontinuing of the Sound K40. There might have been new environmenatl regulations in the USA, BUT, as it used to read on the boxes, film was manufactured in France and assembled (=loaded into the cartridges?) in the USA. So the solvents for the striping were an issue for Europe. That's why I've always thought this to be just an excuse to make things increasingly hard to S/8 users. And you will agree with me that since then, other pains in the neck took place for us: dismission of Ektachorme 160, introduction of a relatively poor performing "ne" film stock (VNF) and last but not least, the famous issue of the jittery carts.
I am not expecting a clear cut reply from you, but please let your people know, beacause I'd really like to see how they comment on this.
Regards,

Maurizio

BTW: welcome on board

[John_Pytlak]

Dear Maurizio:

The solvents used in magnetic striping required increasingly more efficient "scrubbing" and recycling of the vapors. For the relatively small volume of magnetic striped films, the investment in new equipment could not be justified. Part of the reason most videotape and other magnetic media are now manufactured in less developed countries is that the cost of meeting more stringent environmental regulations in the US and western Europe has become prohibitive.

When you had a problem with a cartridge, did you return it to your dealer, or complain to them? :?:

[MovieStuff]

Hi, John!

Happy to see you here.

I think we may have spoken on the phone before in the past. I've talked to so many people at Kodak over the years, I've lost count. I know from previous conversations that Kodak would like to see more people use film and, specifically, Kodak would like to see more people use 16mm instead of abandoning ship to mediums like 24P digital. But people rarely start in 16mm and there are two things that are the biggest problems for beginning Super 8 film makers: Telecine and sound acqusition.

If Kodak created a low contrast, fine grain positive Super 8 sound stock that could be easily developed in normal E-6 chemistry, then I think the 16mm market share would have longer legs. Why? Because people that start with film tend to stay with film. People that start with video tend to stay with video. The choice made has nothing to do with quality because, let's face it, beginning efforts in both film or video will pretty much suck. However, all their friends and relatives will tell them that their mini-opus is terrific and, as a result, they will continue to use the medium that gives that same response.

Later, at a point when quality starts to matter, people shooting video will not make the jump to 16mm because the cost would be too much of a shock to their system and, besides, they've become used to the digital look. But people shooting Super 8 will be more likely to move up to 16mm because film is what fuels their comfort zone and is part of their formula for success. But, as it stands, shooting super 8 with sound and transferring to video are just too problematic for the average beginner seduced by the ease of digital. That is why fewer people shoot 16mm now because beginning film makers don't have any real options except to take a chance on potentially jittery silent carts with emulsions that don't lend themselves to quick, inexpensive processing or telecine.

So, I understand the issues regarding "demand" of a product and I know that you don't have anything to do with marketing but it seems to me that Kodak is missing an opportunity that has nothing to do with "demand" and everything to do with creating a "film habit". In other words, if Kodak were to support Super 8 more, regardless of the perceived present demand, then future film makers cutting their teeth now would have a more viable choice than using daddy's video camera to make their first epic. I mean, is it really likely that today's beginning video shooters will see film as the medium of choice years from now and suddenly make the switch? Not likely. If Kodak wants people to use a lot of larger film formats later, then they need to subsidize the smaller formats now. It would be a smart investment in Kodak's future if they did.

Respectfully,

Roger Evans

[John_Pytlak]

Thanks Roger. I share your feelings that Super-8 is often the entry point for tomorrow's great filmmakers. Steven Spielberg certainly started out that way. 8)

Over the years, Kodak has suported the Super-8 format more than any other manufacturer. We still devote a section of our website to the format, and have a variety of film types to choose from:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/super ... .4.6&lc=en

But today, it is easier than ever to "graduate" to 16mm. Good used cameras are available on the Internet auction sites or for rental, processing labs and telecine transfer facilities are eager to work with filmmakers, and the "good side" of the digital world has made editing and video distribution easier than ever, once you transfer those great film images. Many schools offer 16mm facilities, and there are clubs and organizations that facilitate filmmaking.

Look at the wide variety of Kodak films available:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/produ ... .4.4&lc=en

And the labs and transfer facilities around the world:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/indus ... 4.11&lc=en

And the help labs are willing to give:

http://www.acvl.org/manual.htm

For those who are officially "students", Kodak offers much assistance:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/stude ... =0.1&lc=en

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/stude ... .4.3&lc=en

[Cheezy]

Ok it's not exactly news.....but Kodak is moving its business into digital. The article hinted at the company phasing out of film all together.

From what I've heard, they are just going to stop developping new film media since they estimate that they have reached the technical limits of possible evolution of this media.

[MovieStuff]

But today, it is easier than ever to "graduate" to 16mm.

But the problem isn't about graduating to 16mm. The problem is where the beginning film maker starts. It's really a mental issue. Beginning film makers are often intimidated by super 8 and downright scared to death of 16mm. In fact, most professionals I know shooting video are scared of 16mm. So shooting Super 8 needs to as effortless as shooting video, which it pretty much used to be. Again, this has nothing to do with quality and it has everything to do with creating a "comfort zone" for the film maker and I can assure you that not many beginners will start with 16mm and those youngsters that start with video tend to stay there. What will they shoot when they grow up? Why should they change? More to the point, if digital keeps eating up film turf, then will these budding film makers of tomorrow even have a choice? Again, now is the time for Kodak to encourage young film makers to shoot Super 8 and, to do that, Kodak needs to make it as attactive as shooting miniDV.

Roger

[yosemitesamiam]

delete.

[yosemitesamiam]

delete.

[yosemitesamiam]

But today, it is easier than ever to "graduate" to 16mm.

But the problem isn't about graduating to 16mm. The problem is where the beginning film maker starts. It's really a mental issue. Beginning film makers are often intimidated by super 8 and downright scared to death of 16mm. In fact, most professionals I know shooting video are scared of 16mm. So shooting Super 8 needs to as effortless as shooting video, which it pretty much used to be. Again, this has nothing to do with quality and it has everything to do with creating a "comfort zone" for the film maker and I can assure you that not many beginners will start with 16mm and those youngsters that start with video tend to stay there. What will they shoot when they grow up? Why should they change? More to the point, if digital keeps eating up film turf, then will these budding film makers of tomorrow even have a choice? Again, now is the time for Kodak to encourage young film makers to shoot Super 8 and, to do that, Kodak needs to make it as attactive as shooting miniDV.

Roger

I got into film making, and really for home use, after watching hours of family movies that were shot with K25 on an old Kodak Brownie. One night after watching I went on eBay and starting looking at cameras. I bought a few Kodak Brownies as they were 2-10 dollars each...purchased a projector, and had it all shipped. I called John Schwind and ordered 4 rolls of double 8 film. I shot one roll in the Brownie and went online looking for a better camera...hadn't developed the K25 yet, but just knew it wasn't what I wanted. I found Bolex...AHHA!!! Something I could really sink my teeth into, and get a good workout at the same time! I think I paid $450 on eBay for the camera and 3 Switar lenses...I also purchased a Bolex projector (sweet, BTW). I popped my 2nd roll of K25 into the Bolex Rex 2 8mm camera. So far I have shot half the roll. It has been 6 months since I turned the roll over, and I haven't shot with it since. Why you ask? Simple...lack of emultion choices, and rumors (true and not) that the 8mm format is going away in the not so distant future. It was mentioned earlier...just because K25 is gone is not reason to give up a format. However, when you are cut down to 3 choices in emultion, and 2/3 of it is B&W, it makes you not want to use it much longer...even if it is cheaper to get into. Mind you all this has happened and I STILL haven't had a single roll developed.

I went to Kodak's website and started reading with the thought in the back of my mind that, "Hey! I have a now 1 year old son who deserves what I got...a shitload of old films his crazy ass parents made." What did I find? 16mm. Why? Because of the emultion choices, and the fact that Kodak is still spending $$ on R&D, and that the same emultions are available in 35mm, which is what major movie companies use...it builds confidence in my mind that my pricy equipment will still be useable in the next atleast 15 years or so. What was great this time is that I knew Bolex made a camera very very similar to what I already had, but in the 16mm format. Back to eBay I went. This time I didn't get off so cheap. I purchased a Rex5 camera with no lenses (well, a vario switar 70 I don't use...incase anyone wants to offer me some money for it) for $1400. I then found an eBay listing that had expired with no bids on a matched brand new set of Switar lenses... 26mm f/1.1, 12mm f/1.6 and 70mm f/1.9 I believe are the specs...the lenses cost me another $2200...and some time on the phone contacting the guy to purchase them. I also picked up a nice old projector made by Kodak (Pageant) this time to play it all back (Thanks to Herb Montes for suggesting this particular model...it is great).

That I said, I now have shot 7 rolls of tri-x and 4 rolls of plus-x film...all the new emultion technology and love it! Every roll came out except my very first (because the stupid operator forgot his variable shutter was closed...woopsy!) I put together a 600 foot film of our son playing, learning and living life for Christmas, and since have filmed Christmas, his birthday and very first walking experience! The camera has film in the fridge waiting for it at all times. Shit yeah, it is an expensive hobby...and way more expensive than DV will ever be. Hell, Sam's Club has DV camcorders for $368 bucks, and you can buy 6 hours of tape for it at the low price of $22.

My wife and I laugh because we are stuck in the digital age with a 20lb canon that eats film at a rate of close to $20 per minute developed! Do I care? Naw...the film is worth way more to me. I have watched the old films on the wall over and over...not once have I ever pulled out the VHS tapes we recorded later down the road. The magnetic tape just collects dust and deteriorates without a VCR in site. My father calls me the "High Tech Caveman." because I use a digital camera for stills, but shoot film for home movies.

Getting back...my first experiences with 16mm have been excellent. Even though I've only shot a few rolls compared to most all of you, I can say I woudn't trade it for anything. Yes, I have only shot B&W so far...mostly for ease of use...not haven't to figure out filters yet...or figure out where I'm sending it for developing...as the time constraints for my Christmas project wouldn't allow for develop time...and Franklin Film Lab is less than 15 minutes from my house. Will I try color? Yes. If the emultion is available to me, I'm going to try it...all of it. I want to see what they do. I want to experience for myself what is best for me. So far except for the one roll, everything has come out beautiful, sharp, and perfectly exposed (thanks to a $400 light meter).

Maybe I'm the antithesis to what Kodak considers the normal user. Or maybe it is people like me who will save film for disappearing for good. How many people would spend hours and hours on eBay shopping for really nice equipment to use...and then lay out nearly $5000 total when all was said and done on a single 600 foot project? Not many probably. Although, I did it...so I'd like to assume there are more out there like me. I would also like to point out that, yes, I do say "eBay" a lot...but did anyone ever stop and realize that without eBay, film may have died long ago...or may have died sooner than it ever will? There is no way on earth I could have put together the ensemble I did without that website. No way, no how...wouldn't have happened. And without this site, I would have never realized that film was still being made for 8mm, which initially, although briefly, got me started filming.

With that said, I now step off my soapbox and get some long awaited sleep... ...besides, its too dark to film now.

-Sam