Bolex H8 models's difference

[Cinepugno]

I tried to explain to a friend a difference of threading of a Bolex H8 Rex 4, compared to other models.
With the photo I'll explain.
Who has a Rex 4 confirms that the film is passed as in photo 1 and not as in photo 2?
My friend had doubts because the white arrow of loading seems to be heading towards the other opening, but if the film is pushed in as in photo 2 does not snap.
I know that in other models the film slips into the opening of photo 2 but not in Rex 4.
Anyone Confirm?

[bolextech]

Follow the arrow.
It's impossible to insert film as shown in the top photo.
The bottom photo is correct.

Jean-Louis

[Mmechanic]

The manufacturer’s indication should be followed. If the film cannot be pushed up to the sprocket drum, something is in the way. Cut the film at an angle with the built-in knife or to a flat arrowhead. No H-8 models were sold that would allow to thread directly onto the sprocket drum but H-16 models that take the 400-ft. magazine.

[JeremyC]

The owners manual for an RX8 has the second photo as the correct path.

[Cinepugno]

Thank you, guys!
I'm talking about on the various forum, but, in my opinion, there is confusion.
Of course, I'm talking about this topic with modesty, for see if the problem is of my camera or not, and to inform a possible curiosity of Bolex H8 Rex 4
None model of H8 has the mechanism that goes directly on the pinion? No, impossibile, this is a photo of a H8 Rex 3 (does not have the metal's small piece of on the right, as the Rex 4), the film goes ABSOLUTELY directly on the pinion:


And do not be fooled by the H8 manual that is available for the web, that refers to the H8 Rex 1, look at the figures of the cameras compared to Bolex collector.

[Cinepugno]

And take into account that:
- The part of the camera where the white arrows are printed is the same as the other models, to save productions of piece, not done one specific for Rex 4
- The mechanism where you should put the film in the photo 2 is different from the other Rex, only TOP looks identical.
However they are only hypotheses, I'm not sure of any of the two options, I'll do a video for explain the differences.

EDIT:
In this video of Rex 4 you can see how the camera is loaded with the method of photo 1. The film has no hitch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blXD3vP ... e=youtu.be

In this video of Rex 4 you can see how the camera can not "pull" the film with the method of photo 2. I tried to film the detail of the mechanism.
As mentioned before, the mechanism only from above seems like any other H8 Rex, but if you look carefully you see that it is done on purpose to make only "support" the film on his side, but not to "contain" the film.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWBZYXP ... e=youtu.be

[bolextech]

In your videos, you curl up the film into a ball to straighten out the film's natural curl.
Who told you to do this ? Nobody does this; it is totally unnecessary.
The only reason you seem to be able to load film in "sequenza 1" is that the piece must bent from it's normal straight position.
In any case, loading it this way, there is 100% chance of getting scratches on the film base.

Jean-Louis

[Cinepugno]

I curl beacuse the test film is old and very curly... I also tested without the "ball", with another new test film, it is the same story.
And not "Nobody does this", someone (of course, not all!) does something on the tip of the film, I saw some video and read some manual, someone "smooth" the tip of the film to make it easier to enter.

He does "a turn" to enter the film in the hole better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKWLJHHy6YA

I know other videos, but I find them more

But "getting scratches" is not "impossible to insert," we have already taken a step forward...

[Mmechanic]

Luigi, senti:

In the first video the film is not presented to the mechanism as indicated by the arrow. There is a pair of rollers it has to go in between.

In the second video I see that the film guidance must have been disassembled. It is not correctly mounted. That camera needs to be readjusted by a trained technician.

Mi dispiace, ma io ho lavorato abbastanzamente su queste cineprese Paillard-Bolex H per conoscerle. Mi dispiace ancora una volta perchè ho dovuto chiudere la mia bottega.

Spend and send, spend un pugno di dollaro, send to Bolex, Yverdon.

[Cinepugno]

Hi, Mmechanic!
I mailed the Bolex, they have that I should call, for now I can't call in Switzerland. I thought about send it, but at the moment I can not ship a camera that MAYBE is fully functional.
But I must contradict you, the piece is mounted well, look at this photo:





It is mounted as my but .. surprise, this is a Bolex Rex 2 or 3, which, according to my research, has different types of mechanism, probably according to the serial number.
Note that this model also has two different sprockets (gold metal), and SQUARE basis (only base) of pinions where go spools; as the H16! I did not know it could happen.
Components are replaced? More reason to be aware that there are several mechanisms.

[Cinepugno]

And this antoher Rex 4. This model not have the right part of the mechanism and it is threading as in photo 1, despite the white arrow is always the same (it's Rex 4, like my model).
So also the Rex 4 have different types of mechanisms.

[Mmechanic]

This is a Double-Super-8 conversion.

Paillard sold all H-16 with square spool spindles and all H-8 with round ones.
If anything differs, it has to do with remodeling.

The sprocket wheels, by the way, were interchangeable from the beginning on. Paillard held one-sided sprockets in stock for sound film requirements. H-9 cameras were made with interchangeable parts and spacers.

[Cinepugno]

Ah, interesting, I had never seen, from inside, the Double Super 8 conversion! Although, the ad that I had found the photos sold as Double 8, if I seerching it must warn the seller, may He not know!

However, you confirm that the pieces of metal at right (indifferently if is a camera for Double Super 8 or Regular 8, moreover the film width is the same), is mounted such as that on mine, that is the right way?

[Cinepugno]

Another Bolex, again Rex 3 and not modificated for Double Super 8, with right metal part as mounted like on my machine. I believe it is the confirmation of correct assembly of that part.

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTAzM1g3Njg=/ ... v/$_57.JPG

[Cinepugno]

If the film does not load as in photo 2, it would depend from the little metal tongue which I framed well in this photos.
Or... is the entire piece of metal only screwed too far to the left (also because the little tongue is of very hard metal and there isn't sign of bending): I can make this test with slightly loosening the screw without doing damage. I keep you updated.





I tried to ask the Bolex Switzerland, they are very professional, they would remove all my doubts, but I should send it and for a machine that works well (by loading it from the other side without that the film is damaged), that I use for years without any problem, which has a good stability of the film, it is well greased, which is essentially in good condition, do not feel like spending more than €300 for a little metal piece, understand me, eheh! [Big Grin]
Can anyone confirm that the little is in right position? Other suggestions? [Smile]