Kodachrome fades ???

[tim]

Found this posted on an unrelated Forum:

Kodachrome dyes last a long time in dark storage with a 0.1 density
decrease every 90 years in the magenta layer - and the other dyes are
even more stable.

In light storage conditions though, Kodachrome has real problems.
Fluorescent light creates a 0.1 density decrease in the magenta layer
in about 8 years and Tungsten-Halogen creates a 0.1 density decrease
at about 1.5 hours which means the image will fade to green.

Wilhelm's conclusions on Kodachrome are thus: Kodachrome is best when
little or no projection of the original is expected. Kodachrome has
the worst projector-fading of any color slide film on the market.

Kodachrome is an excellent film if projection can be avoided.

But don't take my word for it - if you've got a few hours spare, you
can download (all 744 pages!) of The Permanence and Care of Color
Photographs: Traditional and Digital Color Prints, Color Negatives,
Slides, and Motion Pictures by Henry Wilhelm from here:

This is not my experience. Can anyone here make an authoritative comment?

[audadvnc]

According to Kodak, Ektachrome has better dye stability under high brightness conditions, such as a slide projector. Kodachrome has better long term dye stability in dark storage. Its high brightness dye stability may not be as much of an issue for motion picture projectionists as each frame is exposed to intense light for only a fraction of a second, as opposed to still slides which may be projected continuously.

[tlatosmd]

What Audadvnc said, and many people here said their Kodachrome still photos never fade no matter whether they're from the 80s or from the 40s. Must be a mere slide issue, if any at all.

I remember a quote that scientific research revealed Kodachrome motion picture film keeps unaffected by time for at least 500 years, which was how far they could check.

[David M. Leugers]

One of the print stocks collectors seek are Kodachrome prints of color films. Films projected hundreds, maybe thousands of times (such as in a rental print of a popular film) show little or no noticeable fade. The average use of individuals projecting their home films is probably not even an issue. My personal experience confirms this. I have not seen any fade in any of my Kodachrome films, some thirty years old... I have always stored my films on a reel inside a can in a cool and dry place. My grandkids will be able to watch these films in full color when they are my age...


David M. Leugers

[Angus]

If you think about it...each frame is subjected to projection light for only a fraction of a second in motion picture film. Once wound into a spool it is effectively in darkness...even if the spool is stored in the light. However since most people at least store thier films in a can or box and in a cupboard...the issue is pretty null and void.

However...slide are a slightly different matter. They often will be projected for many seconds or even a few minutes at a time. And I can say with some degree of certainty that Kodachrome slides keep their colour and contrast better then Ektachrome...which in turn keeps better than AgfaChrome or PerutzChrome.

[Uppsala BildTeknik]

Then what makes Kodachrome go bad?
Because I have seen quite a few bad Kodachrome reels...

Perhaps some are damaged in the processing, but probably not all of them.
Is bad storage "the big bastard" ruining old Kodachrome films? Probably, if what they say is true then no Kodachrome films to this date have been affected by time at all. Sounds almost unlikely...

[tlatosmd]

I'd suppose the majority of K40 damage is done by poor exposure, processing, and outdating before shooting/processing.

What makes the reels you saw look bad? Kodachrome fades to magenta/pinkish when outdated before processing, but not afterwards.

[audadvnc]

Then what makes Kodachrome go bad?

Probably just hanging around that shifty Ektachrome lot ... every parent's fears ...

Is bad storage "the big bastard" ruining old Kodachrome films?

Proper storage conditions are necessary for anything to last. The trick is to find proper storage conditions at a price you can afford. In an old cardboard box under the basement steps is not the optimal environment, but that's where most S8 films wind up...considering the neglect my family's films have seen over the decades, I'd say any movie film holds up pretty well.

[Angus]

I have two pieces of anecdotal evidence here.

My late grandfather shot a few miles of reg 8mm from 1968-1972

in 1993 these were passed to me, seeing as I'm the only one in the family who retained an interest in movie making. In the intervening 21 years they had not been screened as far as anyone could remember. They had been stored in an attic in a cardboard box...mostly on 50' reels in their yellow mailers.

All films look as if they were shot yesterday with the exception of a small number of his earliest films which have dirt on them. A few reels had been spliced onto three 200' reels and the chemical splices had all failed. I replaced these with tape splices in 2000 and thus far they've held.


In 2003 I inherited the photographic collection of my great aunt. This included a *lot* of slides in Kodachrome, Ektachrome, Agfachrome and perutzChrome. Generally the Agfa and Perutz material is now awful. At best I have monochrome images in pink and white.

The Ektachrome has fared better, but has faded drastically such that the colours are no longer natural or vibrant. They look old.

The Kodachrome exhibits no damage whatsoever, it has held up as well as a B&W negative does.

Dates of material ranges from 1940's through to 1990's. The slides were all stored inside straight projector magazines, these being inside card sleeves dating from the 60's...I don't know where the older material was stored prior to the late 60's.

I know I'm only one person...but the evidence suggests that Kodachrome material...regardless of storage conditions...weathers the ages better than all other colour films.

[tlatosmd]

Generally the Agfa and Perutz material is now awful. At best I have monochrome images in pink and white.

That's interesting, someone mentioned before that Peruchrome fades to pink after having been processed. When I shot 20 years outdated Peruchome, it actually came out very bluish, like without a daylight filter, and all Agfa Moviechromes (except for those boxed in a red and blue box with a white Agfa logo) outdating up to 18 years ago comes out slightly bluish and very aesthetic.

Could it be pinkish = bluish due to reversal process?

[audadvnc]

the evidence suggests that Kodachrome material...regardless of storage conditions...weathers the ages better than all other colour films.

Yes. But is this news to anyone remotely aware of the issue?

If not, why bring it up again, and again, and again ... :roll:

[Angus]

The post above suggests that if Kodachrome is projected or stored such that it can be exposed to light, then it deteriorates fast.

[John_Pytlak]

The post above suggests that if Kodachrome is projected or stored such that it can be exposed to light, then it deteriorates fast.

As others have noted, the light fading would only be an issue for slides, as the accumulated exposure time/intensity is much greater than for movies. But don't leave your KODACHROME slides out, exposed to sunlight or fluorescent light --- the UV in these light sources causes the most fading.